Negative Theology
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- mdsimpson92
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Essentially, Negative theology is a method of mysticism that deals with understanding God not by saying what God is, but rather what God isn't.
Meta, I think you have more background in it. Though it does remind me of "the Dao that can be spoken of is not the Dao."
Meta, I think you have more background in it. Though it does remind me of "the Dao that can be spoken of is not the Dao."
Julia: It's all... a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
- mdsimpson92
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Re: Negative Theology
Perhaps, and that actually reminds me of Paul Tillich saying we might have to abandon the term "God" due to the fact that that can mean several differentn things.
Of course we can use terms to denote what interpretation of the divine we actually are talking about. Panentheism for instance.
Of course we can use terms to denote what interpretation of the divine we actually are talking about. Panentheism for instance.
Julia: It's all... a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
- mdsimpson92
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Re: Negative Theology
Actually perhaps "jarring" is not the right word. Perhaps the better word is clear and well defined terminology. I can defininately understand how the word "God" has so much baggage. That is probably why people like Tillich used terms like "ground of being" it conjures an image but it works as a metaphor for what their interpretation of the divine is.
Julia: It's all... a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
- mdsimpson92
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- Joined:Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:05 pm
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Re: Negative Theology
This is when I get sloppy in my reading. you already have covered my statements. I have no issue so far. Negative theology is close, but that is rather more of a tool that is used. like "god does not lack." it works its way around.Speusippus wrote: Is this negative theology? It's close in a way, but I don't think it is. Negative theology says there's something about the nature of God that makes facts about him inherently inexpressible. I don't claim that facts about God are inherently inexpressible (in fact I think that within the church we can express truths about God, using the word 'god' even, perfectly well) but rather that it has become impossible to express facts about God in public. It has become impossible for people to understand each other (except perhaps within the church) when they use the word 'god'.
Granted that also depends on how you view the divine. I am personally a panentheist.
Julia: It's all... a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Re: Negative Theology
My God, you are spamming yourself.
No, withdrawing verbiage about religious belief and attempting to let your light shine through actions only is not negative theology. It's an interesting thought though because it's much Frtitz Mouthner's point about concrete gesture. Language becomes too abstract then we must withdraw into concrete gesture. That's a theme taken up in Joyce, Finnegan's Wake.
Negative theology is counterbalanced by mystical union. It's the idea that God is beyond our understanding. We can't say what God is so we say what God is not. We can't show you a donut hole so we show what's around the hole.
the other side of the coin is you don't talk about what God is but what he's not but experience God directly in mystical union so you know by experience what God is.
No, withdrawing verbiage about religious belief and attempting to let your light shine through actions only is not negative theology. It's an interesting thought though because it's much Frtitz Mouthner's point about concrete gesture. Language becomes too abstract then we must withdraw into concrete gesture. That's a theme taken up in Joyce, Finnegan's Wake.
Negative theology is counterbalanced by mystical union. It's the idea that God is beyond our understanding. We can't say what God is so we say what God is not. We can't show you a donut hole so we show what's around the hole.
the other side of the coin is you don't talk about what God is but what he's not but experience God directly in mystical union so you know by experience what God is.
Have Theology, Will argue: wire Metacrock
Buy My book: The Trace of God: Warrant for belief
Buy My book: The Trace of God: Warrant for belief
Re: Negative Theology
I remember reading David Tracey'swritings on negative/apophatic theology. That was around 2004... geez, seven years ago already.....
The “One” is the space of the “world” of the tick, but also the “pinch” of the lobster, or that rendezvous in person to confirm online pictures (with a new lover or an old God). This is the machinery operative...as “onto-theology."
Dr Ward Blanton
Dr Ward Blanton
Re: Negative Theology
Classical theology in a nutshell:
A.) Human knowledge (i..e., neo-platonism's version of human knowledge) is always balanced with what we know about God through B.) revelation. (i.e., the Hebrew Scriptures)
IOW, The timeless God who is above all attributes, is ALSO the personal God of the Jews, who interacts in history, has emotions, attributes etc, etc...
Now, the ordinary heathen would say that Classical Theology involves a massive contradiction.
So, CT plays the mystery card .
A. and B. are not really at odds with each other, .....it's merely the limitation of human language that makes it seem so.
and if that doesn't work,....we send doubters to the rack!!!
A.) Human knowledge (i..e., neo-platonism's version of human knowledge) is always balanced with what we know about God through B.) revelation. (i.e., the Hebrew Scriptures)
IOW, The timeless God who is above all attributes, is ALSO the personal God of the Jews, who interacts in history, has emotions, attributes etc, etc...
Now, the ordinary heathen would say that Classical Theology involves a massive contradiction.
So, CT plays the mystery card .
A. and B. are not really at odds with each other, .....it's merely the limitation of human language that makes it seem so.
and if that doesn't work,....we send doubters to the rack!!!
- mdsimpson92
- Posts:2187
- Joined:Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:05 pm
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Re: Negative Theology
Sorry Meta, your right I was spamming.URBILD wrote:Classical theology in a nutshell:
A.) Human knowledge (i..e., neo-platonism's version of human knowledge) is always balanced with what we know about God through B.) revelation. (i.e., the Hebrew Scriptures)
IOW, The timeless God who is above all attributes, is ALSO the personal God of the Jews, who interacts in history, has emotions, attributes etc, etc...
Now, the ordinary heathen would say that Classical Theology involves a massive contradiction.
So, CT plays the mystery card .
A. and B. are not really at odds with each other, .....it's merely the limitation of human language that makes it seem so.
and if that doesn't work,....we send doubters to the rack!!!
I remember Hartshorne criticising Aquinas for "paying God metaphysical compliments" by giving God attributes like absolute omnipotence and total omniscience ect.
But I don't think that neo-platonism would count as classical theism, at least not according to Stanford Encyclopedia. Then again "The One" was not a very personal deity in Neoplatonism.
Julia: It's all... a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Spike Spiegel: Yeah... just a dream...
Re: Negative Theology
Thats a cool thought. And absolutely right, it is - though i never heard or thought of that before.....Metacrock wrote: Language becomes too abstract then we must withdraw into concrete gesture. That's a theme taken up in Joyce, Finnegan's Wake.
Counterbalanced or complimented? How do we find the strength/inspiration to "withdraw into concrete gesture" (since talk is almost always much easier than action) if not within mystical experiences?Negative theology is counterbalanced by mystical union.
The “One” is the space of the “world” of the tick, but also the “pinch” of the lobster, or that rendezvous in person to confirm online pictures (with a new lover or an old God). This is the machinery operative...as “onto-theology."
Dr Ward Blanton
Dr Ward Blanton
Re: Negative Theology
That's very Western. Negative theology, otoh, mostly comes out of (or at least back from) the East, doesnt it? (I mean, the RCC silenced Meister Ekhart for saying apophatic type stuff.)URBILD wrote:Classical theology in a nutshell:
A.) Human knowledge (i..e., neo-platonism's version of human knowledge) is always balanced with what we know about God through B.) revelation. (i.e., the Hebrew Scriptures)
IOW, The timeless God who is above all attributes, is ALSO the personal God of the Jews, who interacts in history, has emotions, attributes etc, etc...
Now, the ordinary heathen would say that Classical Theology involves a massive contradiction.
So, CT plays the mystery card .
A. and B. are not really at odds with each other, .....it's merely the limitation of human language that makes it seem so.
and if that doesn't work,....we send doubters to the rack!!!
The “One” is the space of the “world” of the tick, but also the “pinch” of the lobster, or that rendezvous in person to confirm online pictures (with a new lover or an old God). This is the machinery operative...as “onto-theology."
Dr Ward Blanton
Dr Ward Blanton